Really?

Discuss any interesting vintage computer Trade Me items here

Really?

Postby YetiSeti on Sat Aug 27, 2011 10:14 pm

- Commodore Vic 20, box,joy stick, games, mags -
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =401186562

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Re: Really?

Postby Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:02 am

$610?... for a Vic 20?... Holy god, are they that rare? :shock:
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Re: Really?

Postby tezza on Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:43 am

Well, I guess it's like the e-bay Apple II recently bought. If you really, really want it and you've got the money, you'll get it.
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Re: Really?

Postby Carcenomy on Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:18 am

610... honestly?! That incites words of shock and curse in this household... it's just a VIC20!
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Re: Really?

Postby lizardb0y on Sun Aug 28, 2011 7:56 am

It looked like an early Vic-20, and the 1540 is rare as rocking horse s#!t, not to mention the original Datasette. I can understand a high selling price for this, though $610 does seem extreme.
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Re: Really?

Postby Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:06 am

tezza wrote:Well, I guess it's like the e-bay Apple II recently bought. If you really, really want it and you've got the money, you'll get it.


Heh Heh.. Yes, I realise that. :)

But the machines that carry a premium usually hold a certain place in the "pantheon". The Apple II (particularly early revisions) definitely holds a special place in the history of microcomputers. (A real Apple I being in a price class all by itself.)

I wouldn't have put the VIC20 as holding that position in Commodore's lineup. Maybe the Pet? Am I wrong here? (I pretty much equate the C64 as being Commodore's "IIe", and work out from there.)

Yes, it's a less common member of the lineup, 240v version, well appointed and in lovely condition BUT... The auction went a bit mad because it felt so close. (easy to obtain. i.e. not in the USA)

It feels more like the IIgs I paid a bit too much for :)
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Re: Really?

Postby YetiSeti on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:04 am

But the machines that carry a premium usually hold a certain place in the "pantheon". The Apple II (particularly early revisions) definitely holds a special place in the history of microcomputers. (A real Apple I being in a price class all by itself.)

There you go again insulting the Commodore gods :twisted: :evil:

It seems it's the Vic-1540 drive that is the rarity. In summary, rare, was more expensive than the computer in the day, faster than later drives, boxed one worth around $400US.

So perhaps in all, it unluckily sold at market value. I do note a good half dozen Oz collectors regularly sniffing and biting in our vintage computer category. I get antsy because I think they have a big enough market over there that we shouldn't have to share our small trappings.

Maybe the rare tape drive carries a price ticket too and the magazines seem to of great value to the other bidder. I really thought that what looked equally like a roll of loo paper in the photo might have detracted from the value of the auction. Not the best look.

------

http://www.lemon64.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 6b965c9231
http://sleepingelephant.com/denial/wiki ... disk_drive
http://www.zimmers.net/cbmpics/d1540s.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_1540
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Re: Really?

Postby lizardb0y on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:15 am

YetiSeti wrote: I really thought that what looked equally like a roll of loo paper in the photo might have detracted from the value of the auction. Not the best look.


The "roll of loo paper" is actually printer paper for the 1520 in the auction. :)
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Re: Really?

Postby tezza on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:23 am

lizardb0y wrote:The "roll of loo paper" is actually printer paper for the 1520 in the auction. :)


Here is a little article on that device.
http://www.zimmers.net/cbmpics/peserial2.html
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Re: Really?

Postby Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:28 am

YetiSeti wrote:
But the machines that carry a premium usually hold a certain place in the "pantheon". The Apple II (particularly early revisions) definitely holds a special place in the history of microcomputers. (A real Apple I being in a price class all by itself.)

There you go again insulting the Commodore gods :twisted: :evil:

Heh. Nah, not really. Yes, the original Apple II is special to me.. but it also held a number of of other significant milestones.

It really was the first (widely available) machine that had everything you need, right out of the box. Things that we take for granted these days. Colour Graphics (in fact a video output at all)... A keyboard. ROM's and BASIC built in... A tape + joystick port (ANY peripherals in fact.)... an open, easily extendible architecture... in 1977.

the VIC 20 is a later machine... And I wasn't suggesting it wasn't important... Just that it possibly didn't occupy THAT spot in commodore's history.
YetiSeti wrote:It seems it's the Vic-1540 drive that is the rarity. In summary, rare, was more expensive than the computer in the day, faster than later drives, boxed one worth around $400US.

I think the package as a whole certainly is impressive. It's nearly everything you might want for a VIC20, and in good nick.
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Re: Really?

Postby lizardb0y on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:43 am

Gibsaw wrote:
YetiSeti wrote:
But the machines that carry a premium usually hold a certain place in the "pantheon". The Apple II (particularly early revisions) definitely holds a special place in the history of microcomputers. (A real Apple I being in a price class all by itself.)

There you go again insulting the Commodore gods :twisted: :evil:

Heh. Nah, not really. Yes, the original Apple II is special to me.. but it also held a number of of other significant milestones.

It really was the first (widely available) machine that had everything you need, right out of the box. Things that we take for granted these days. Colour Graphics (in fact a video output at all)... A keyboard. ROM's and BASIC built in... A tape + joystick port (ANY peripherals in fact.)... an open, easily extendible architecture.


The TRS-80 Model 1 was released less than a month after the Apple II - it too had everything bundled in a nice consumer style package, and it out-sold everything Apple came up for years. The Commodore PET 2001 was a full consumer package announced several months before the Apple II although it didn't ship until later the same year. It also out-sold the Apple II series through the '70s. I know it is popular to believe that Apple invented the consumer PC market, but it just isn't true.

EDIT: Sorry. That came across a bit ranty. I think all the Steve Jobs hysteria has been wearing me down this week.
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Re: Really?

Postby tezza on Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:53 am

lizardb0y wrote:The TRS-80 Model 1 was released less than a month after the Apple II - it too had everything bundled in a nice consumer style package, and it out-sold everything Apple came up for years. The Commodore PET 2001 was a full consumer package announced several months before the Apple II although it didn't ship until later the same year. It also out-sold the Apple II series through the '70s. I know it is popular to believe that Apple invented the consumer PC market, but it just isn't true.


Absolutely right Andrew. I'm not sure Gibsaw was saying that though, rather he was just enthusing on a model he obviously loves. It did have colour and was very expandable.

Interestingy, I'm engaged in a discussion/debate on Steve Jobs and Apple "myths" right now. Check out the following thread if interested.
http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum ... esignation

My postings appear later in the piece.
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Re: Really?

Postby Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:23 am

tezza wrote:
lizardb0y wrote:The TRS-80 Model 1 was released less than a month after the Apple II -...<snip>...out-sold the Apple II series through the '70s. I know it is popular to believe that Apple invented the consumer PC market, but it just isn't true.

Absolutely right Andrew. I'm not sure Gibsaw was saying that though, rather he was just enthusing on a model he obviously loves. It did have colour and was very expandable.

I'd debate that on a number of levels, guys... but it would be a separate discussion.

Tezza is right. It wasn't where I was going with it.

The point was more that Tezza was stirring me about the Apple II I bought, and the two aren't really in the same league. No matter where one puts the Apple II's importance vs the TRS-80 vs the CBM Pet etc... In terms being a collector's item, the VIC20 just doesn't occupy that spot in commodore's history. It's not one of that first wave, and it's a little surprising to see it in that price bracket.

But the completeness of the package, including the apparently "unobtainium" Vic-1540 diminishes my surprise somewhat. :)
Last edited by Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:41 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Really?

Postby Gibsaw on Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:38 am

lizardb0y wrote:EDIT: Sorry. That came across a bit ranty. I think all the Steve Jobs hysteria has been wearing me down this week.

You're not alone... Apple lost my love when they closed the architecture with the Mac.. They lost even more of my love when they closed the door and put bars and a bouncer on it with the "appstore".

Steve is a charismatic man. He's the double edged sword that damages Apple and keeps it alive. Without his stubbornness and bad cockups, Apple might have been bigger sooner. Without his drive and his polarising, cult-of-mac rabble rousing, Apple might have been dead.. Who knows.
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Re: Really?

Postby tezza on Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:20 pm

Gibsaw wrote:You're not alone... Apple lost my love when they closed the architecture with the Mac.. They lost even more of my love when they closed the door and put bars and a bouncer on it with the "appstore".

Steve is a charismatic man. He's the double edged sword that damages Apple and keeps it alive. Without his stubbornness and bad cockups, Apple might have been bigger sooner. Without his drive and his polarising, cult-of-mac rabble rousing, Apple might have been dead.. Who knows.


Yes, this echos my own assessment of Jobs and the direction he took Apple.
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